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Ok So what Percentage change does one see on the range if you turn the AC on? And what percentage change do you see when you turn the heater on?
For example let’s say my car fully Charged and shows a range of 180...this is when I turn my car on and without any AC or heater. how much will it drop if In the case if I turn my ac on? And how much will it drop when I turn my heater on?
 

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It really depends on the temperature and blower speed. The higher each gets, the lower the range gets. I'll do a test later when the car comes home and let you know.
 

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Also, the GOM (the estimated available miles--Guess-O-Meter) takes into account if you turn on the heater or activate other features that draw on the battery. You should see a drop in you GOM soon after you turn on the heater.
 

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Ok so I i switched the heater on today and my range that was showing dropped by 30%. 30%!!! That’s a lot in my opinion. is this normal?

so If I understand correctly, and plz correct me if I wrong, outside extreme temp either too hot or too cold, affects the range displayed. For example at extreme temps (hot or cold), my car will show a range of let’s say 180, and at optimal temp it will show a range of 210 (assuming both times car is equally charged).

Now the 30% drop in range to what is showing on my screen will be when I turn the heating on.

Also I noticed that cooling the car takes a lot less miles out of your range display than heating does. I wasn’t focused on cooling atm and it wasn’t my car, so didn’t get the exact percentage drop of cooling , but heating was a staggering 30%.

@JNealCox
 

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That's right, but also, for the heater, a penalty of 30% does sound like a lot. You might find that as you drive, the GOM might get a better idea of how much power you are actually pulling from the battery to heat the car, so it might start giving you back some miles. What are your typical ambient temperatures? You might find that making use of the seat heat/AC might be more efficient than heating up the whole cabin.
 

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@Sammk There are far too many variables to say "turning on the heat drops range by 30%".
If you run it on full heat, full fan speed, yes that's probably a reasonable approximation for any EV. The GOM will then increase as you drop the target temp and/or the fan speed. Also - setting the heat to Auto-70F for a 30-mile each way commute will result in far better efficiency than warming the vehicle each time for a series of 5-mile commutes. The vehicle will learn your habits to an extent and your past heating and driving will result in a range hit. Remember, the vehicle is not only heating the cabin, but the batteries and systems we can't see.
Drive mode: efficiency will make the heat/AC system less aggressive, and increase the GOM likewise.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
@JNealCox @Joe welll to be fair, I did have it on full blow and full heat, and I was testing the range. My Etron hasn’t arrived yet. I heard about this Etron heater range problem, so I was just test driving a friends Etron to see myself to see. It was a short ride and short test obviously as it’s someone else’s car, about 10 miles. I was kind of worried because about the range going down by 30% as mines a Etron 50 Which has a even lower range than the Etron 55. Yes I won’t have the heater turned on like this all the time but for a short time I might. I guess proper testing can be done when mine Arrives.

one thing though what I noticed was that I had put it on heater and set a certain temp. However when I switched off the heating and turned it back on again, it went to cooling . Shouldn’t it go back to the last settings? For example if it’s winters and I’m using the heater, if I turn off and turn on it shouldnt go to cooling I would say.

also when turning on the heater are you suppose to have tha ac button switched on or off? As I could turn thr ac button on or off while the heater was on.
 

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Yes, definitely something to be aware of if the range is already a concern for you. If you are going to be driving long distances in cold weather frequently enough, you might want to wait to see what is on the market in a year or two. Rivian and BMW are coming out with ~300mi estimated vehicles.

Climate control should go back to the last setting when you turn it back on - I have never encountered that issue with my vehicle. I have become used to the Auto temp feature, which I never liked much in previous Toyota and Subaru, but it is very well implemented in the etron in my opinion!

AC: On will draw more power, but definitely have it on if windows are fogging up.
 

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E Tron's "heater problem" is actually very good compared with other EV's. The heat pump consumes 1/3 of the electricity in comparison with other A/C methods. Tesla's are notorious for electricity loss from Cabin Conditioning. The Model Y contains Tesla's first attempt at incorporating a heat pump, and it is being added to Model 3's. So as far as your dealing with the "heater problem" , the Audi E Tron is probably your best option, for a car with 200 mi + EPA range, available as far as Cabin Conditioning goes. The question is whether it is adequate for you, given the EV range. There is a good reason E Trons are much more popular than Teslas in Norway. You might find this an interesting read: Model Y is the first Tesla with a heat pump. Here’s why that’s a big deal. | Current Automotive
 

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I've noticed that my consumption at 50 deg F when the heater is engaged is noticeably higher than when the AC is on at 110 deg F. I would have expected the heat pump heating function would be the same as the AC function.
 

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How are you measuring that consumption? Hard to compare efficiencies, I suppose. The thermal management comes into play for both cabin comfort and battery conditioning. You might find this document of interest, particularly pgs 126 to 130, or so: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10155750-9999.pdf For example, above 95 deg F, while you are cooling the cabin, the car is actively cooling the battery. On the flip side, in cold weather it appears the car does not start to warm the battery (except when DC charging) until the external temperature drops below 15 deg F.

For cabin temperature, the Heat Pump system seems to be used in two ways to heat the cabin (pgs 128 and 130): 1) from -4 to 68 deg F (pg 130) a circuit involving the heat pump, but not the battery thermal management system is active; 2) when the external temp is between 41 to 68 deg F (pg 128) another heat pump circuit that does involve the battery thermal management system also seems to come into play. In addition to all that, the resistive heater(s) can be pressed into service. Seems like cooling is less complicated, but still has a second circuit that can add in to cool the battery when external temps are above 95 deg F. Clearly, this is much more than just flipping on the heater or the cooler!
 

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Ok So what Percentage change does one see on the range if you turn the AC on? And what percentage change do you see when you turn the heater on?
For example let’s say my car fully Charged and shows a range of 180...this is when I turn my car on and without any AC or heater. how much will it drop if In the case if I turn my ac on? And how much will it drop when I turn my heater on?
I have E-Tron prestige in the US and I only see AC bottom and I did not find a heating bottom. Any idea? Does that mean when the temperature setting is higher than cabin temperature, the heating starts to warm up the cabin?
 

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I have E-Tron prestige in the US and I only see AC bottom and I did not find a heating bottom. Any idea? Does that mean when the temperature setting is higher than cabin temperature, the heating starts to warm up the cabin?
It does seem a little confusing. There is an OFF, and that turns off the whole temp control system. The way I've come to understand it, I think the A/C compressor system is always working, regardless of whether the car is being heated or cooled. First the air is dehumidified (using the air conditioner compressor) by cooling it, and then it is reheated to the desired temp (using the heat pump, or, in more extreme cases, the resistive heater(s)) for delivery into the cabin. If you turn off the A/C, you can no longer get cooling, but you can get heating. However, in that case, the air has not been dehumidified, and so the cabin can start to fog up. (I think this is why Audi gives you the option to go Full A/C, Eco A/C, or Off...when you need to heat up the cabin, you can gain a few miles, if the air is already dry enough initially not to require dehumidifying, if you cut back on the A/C.) So basically, with A/C set to ON, the car always cools down the air to dehumidify it, and the heat pump then warms it up as needed to the desired temperature.
 

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I've noticed that my consumption at 50 deg F when the heater is engaged is noticeably higher than when the AC is on at 110 deg F. I would have expected the heat pump heating function would be the same as the AC function.
My reply to Marklin may explain your observation regarding the higher consumption you observe when heating. When you are cooling the car with a 110 deg F outside temp, you most likely are not having to use the heat pump to warm up the air at all. In fact, the car starts to actively cool the battery above 95 deg F. When you are heating in a 50 deg F environment, the air conditioning compressor system is STILL working to dehumidify the air, in addition to the heat pump then reheating the air to the desired cabin temperature. So in the situations you describe, when heating the car, both the air conditioning and heat pump are working; when cooling, pretty much only the air conditioning. Have you compared consumption when heating with the A/C button turned off?
 

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Discussion Starter #15
It does seem a little confusing. There is an OFF, and that turns off the whole temp control system. The way I've come to understand it, I think the A/C compressor system is always working, regardless of whether the car is being heated or cooled. First the air is dehumidified (using the air conditioner compressor) by cooling it, and then it is reheated to the desired temp (using the heat pump, or, in more extreme cases, the resistive heater(s)) for delivery into the cabin. If you turn off the A/C, you can no longer get cooling, but you can get heating. However, in that case, the air has not been dehumidified, and so the cabin can start to fog up. (I think this is why Audi gives you the option to go Full A/C, Eco A/C, or Off...when you need to heat up the cabin, you can gain a few miles, if the air is already dry enough initially not to require dehumidifying, if you cut back on the A/C.) So basically, with A/C set to ON, the car always cools down the air to dehumidify it, and the heat pump then warms it up as needed to the desired temperature.
first of all I would like to thankyou and @Joe for sharing your knowledge with us! greatly appreciated 👏... you guys truely are an asset to this forum

coming back to the topic, so there is no right or wrong way to heat up your cabin (by right or wrong I mean whether you habe the ac button on or off during heating). If the windows are being fogged up during heating turn the ac button on and if not turn the ac button off. Is my understanding correct ?
 

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Yes, that's what I would do. And if it is cold but range is an issue on a particular trip, others on this forum have advised heat off and using the seat heaters is very efficient.
 

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I second the use of the Seat heater/AC. Nothing beats the seat AC for preventing a sweaty back in hot humid weather. I remember having to really crank up the cabin AC just to cool my back down!
 

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Ok So what Percentage change does one see on the range if you turn the AC on? And what percentage change do you see when you turn the heater on?
For example let’s say my car fully Charged and shows a range of 180...this is when I turn my car on and without any AC

Yes, that's what I would do. And if it is cold but range is an issue on a particular trip, others on this forum have advised heat off and using the seat heaters is very efficient.


Hi there. I'm late to the forum, but was interested reading. One thing that has puzzled me is the sound the heater makes. A/C fine, but heating the car is really loud. I know its an electric vehicle, but I would hope the heater sound wouldn't be louder than the fake disneyland sounds the car makes :)
 

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Curious, I haven't noticed any difference in sound levels between cooling and heating modes. It could be because I've only seen 50 deg F but there should be no difference in what's running either way.
 
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